My two cents on the Jailbreak

[MrGibbage]

The way I see it, no matter what Google and t-mobile do, someone is going to figure out a way around it. It just goes to show that this is something that WE, their customers, WANT. And we will go to great lengths to figure out how to make it work. Some of us want root access to our phone. It's cool. It enables us to do things that won't be possible without it. So, the very best thing for them to do is to give it to us, but with the right protection in place. Force us to set up a proper root account and password. If they are concerned about network security, then they started at the wrong level. The network security needs to be in place beyond the phones. There should be nothing... I say again... NOTHING that we can do with our phones, under any circumstances, to threaten their network security. Quite honestly, that's like saying AOL should take control of all of our computers to ensure they can have a safe network. So, the harder they try to take it away from us, the harder we will try to take it back. The last I saw, I PAID for that phone. It's mine, so why can't I have root access on it?

[Boogdriod]

I am 100% with you on this subject. Who knows, maybe they'll stumble upon this and BOOM! We have it

[pathogen]

I can't disagree with you more. The average user isn't going to want to deal with it or think about it. And to have such and option would make malicious code that much easier to get out of hand. I'd rather they keep it the way it is , jailed environments and people who really want root access can find ways around it. But thats just my two cents and respect your opinion greatly.

[ministersin]

I like the analogy of the computer vs. AOL. Pathogen may be correct that making a change makes your computer more vulnerable and that the average user doesn't need it.

That being said...even if it were available legitimately, the average user would STILL not know how to do it. Or even try and do it.

The average user is not taking down their firewall in Vista, may not even know what a firewall is.

But if I want to take my firewall down, open up a port with an ftp to my entire computer...I think that's my call to make.

Once again the average user would have no need, interest, or technical ability to do this.

Doesn't mean I don't.

This is a bad example because of the G1, but let's be more broad.

Email alone makes you vulnerable to intrusion. Click on the wrong link or open the wrong attachment and bad things can happen (ask about RC29).

So since some Outlook users may not even use the email function on their G1 and email can give viruses access to your phone....maybe we just shouldn't have email on the phone.

Sounds ridiculous, but it is only as ridiculous as saying a terminal application with root access should not be available on a Linux OS.

That's a BASIC functionality of a Linux system. The most BASIC actually.

[pathogen]

I appreciate the fact that I can download and install any compiled android application I want reguardless of where it's from. I'd rather google concentrate on the core components of the phone and I'm sure later on there will be a myriad of tools for root level and shell level access to our phones. Could be worse, you could have to go through one store for all your application needs and not be able to use different basic level applications in leu of google stock apps. I am willing to bet that running applications from the SD card functionality will be implemented I just hope its flagged in the software so people don't go blowing up their phone when they plug it in and mount the sd card. If the implement a flag that says "run from removable" or some crap so developers can tag applications to run in internal or other I think people would be alot happier.

[MrGibbage]

I can't disagree with you more. The average user isn't going to want to deal with it or think about it. And to have such and option would make malicious code that much easier to get out of hand. I'd rather they keep it the way it is , jailed environments and people who really want root access can find ways around it. But thats just my two cents and respect your opinion greatly.

In fact, your disagreement actually amplifies my argument. This is not about the average user. Gaining root access should be "a little hard". I honestly would not be opposed to doing the way my web host does it. If I want root access, I have to send them a photocopy of my ID. Root access is not for beginners, and 95% of the users won't need it, or want it. But then again, there are people that will.

Here's the problem with NOT allowing root access. We WILL find a way to do it. That is the nature of the beast. And since we are going to find different backdoors or exploits in order to make it work, they increase the chance of something bad happening in the process. It pushes everything underground and no one knows what's going on. Someone will figure out how to get root access, it will be discussed among bad people that want to do bad things to us and our phones and we won't know about it.

If google & tmo provide the root access to us, they know how we are getting into the phone and everything is above the table. In the end, that really is the best way.

[JayBachatero]

What people seem to be forgetting is the huge security issue that this hole posed. In case some of you didn't notice, you didn't need a password to even get root access. If they didn't patch this hole, I bet that a mess of applications would've been written to take advantage of this exploit and break hell lose.

[MrGibbage]

Oh, I agree that they need to fix that. There should definitely be a password on the root account. But I want it.

[pathogen]

In the age of the internet every burp or security flaw is posted pretty quickly. And jailbreaking/unlocking is big business and high profile. Every Iphone jailbreak even before it was released was all over every website I think there's more than enough of people poking the busty innards of our phones to keep Google up to speed on enviromental holes. The old addage of oh open access = security is moot now. It's simply not needed. If thats what you wanted why didn't you order an openmoko instead of a corporate controled device? Wishing for something to have/be something it isn't is silly. Its a phone, it runs apps, happens to based on linux. Doesn't mean you need to have all the functionality you have on your linux desktops. By making holes for the 5% of users your opening up a world of hurt. I appreciate your consise and well manored arguments. I hope you eventually get what you're looking for without hurting the rest of us. I would love to see a VM option on the phone to run unix and have access to hardware as long as it controled.

[Stanovoy]

Alternatively, you can pool all the talents together and create a separate Android distribution, kind of like Ubuntu to Linux.

Yet once again alternatively, all you need is for Google to have a certification process for certain OS altering apps. Google can create another market where the apps there will go under rigorous examination for safety before approval.

[pathogen]

Thats another great option Stan! I love that idea!

[enash99]

The way I see it, no matter what Google and t-mobile do, someone is going to figure out a way around it. It just goes to show that this is something that WE, their customers, WANT. And we will go to great lengths to figure out how to make it work. Some of us want root access to our phone. It's cool. It enables us to do things that won't be possible without it. So, the very best thing for them to do is to give it to us, but with the right protection in place. Force us to set up a proper root account and password. If they are concerned about network security, then they started at the wrong level. The network security needs to be in place beyond the phones. There should be nothing... I say again... NOTHING that we can do with our phones, under any circumstances, to threaten their network security. Quite honestly, that's like saying AOL should take control of all of our computers to ensure they can have a safe network. So, the harder they try to take it away from us, the harder we will try to take it back. The last I saw, I PAID for that phone. It's mine, so why can't I have root access on it?


I agree with you, but untill we can some real benefit, like being able to run apps from the SD card. I did run the "top" command and that was intresting to see.

[Re@lly Dope!]

There's a way around Everything so I don't see why Google is trying so hard.

[ickyfehmleh]

There's a way around Everything so I don't see why Google is trying so hard.

You mean besides the "jailbreak" actually being an exploit that bypasses most if not all of the security built around Android and having the ability to be performed programatically without end-users knowing anything had happened?

I view Android as a device with an embedded Linux installation: rarely do such installations expose root, or indeed any sort of Unix, to the end user. Indeed, the whole point of Android is not the underlying Linux installation but the Java-based APIs provided by Google.